<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">Joe Wagner, similar to Clarence Lee of RCM, has given sage advice over the years.For what its worth, I unwittingly used aluminum tubing in my Webra set-up from the start since that's all I had at the time. It's been almost 400 flights so far and the bearings still feel like new. It may be coincidence since the webra has larger bearings than the OS and Joe could be mistaken, but it's easy to test the proposed concept.<BR>
<BR>
I intend to use the information he passed on more completely, and see for myself. I urge others to do the same covering all engine flavors. I will use teflon or aluminum tubing everywhere possible
, and use a teflon block as clunk. Can't replace the brass spray bar and nipples without machining capability, but the other changes should reduce brass contact at least fourfold. <BR>
<BR>
Mine will be Webra and Mintors, and since both are AAC constructed, it automatically eliminates a possible source of catalysis<BR>
<BR>
we'll see<BR>
<BR>
Matt K<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Subj:<B>Re: Fuel/Water, Bearing/Rust </B><BR>
Date:12/6/2003 10:14:22 AM Eastern Standard Time<BR>
From:<A HREF="mailto:rcaerobob@cox.net">rcaerobob@cox.net</A><BR>
Reply-to:<A HREF="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A><BR>
To:<A HREF="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A><BR>
<I>Sent from the Internet </I><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Good point, Bill.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"> Does anyone KNOW if the "brass corrosion"/conversion into acetic acid is the REAL deal? How can we find out?</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"> Wouldn't it be bizarre if the corrosion on bearings issue was due to something like this?</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><BR>
<BR>
Bob Pastorello, Oklahoma<BR>
NSRCA 199, AMA 46373<BR>
<A HREF="mailto:rcaerobob@cox.net">rcaerobob@cox.net</A><BR>
<A HREF="http://www.rcaerobats.net/">www.rcaerobats.net</A><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">----- Original Message ----- <BR>
<B>From:</B> <A HREF="mailto:billglaze@triad.rr.com">Bill Glaze</A> <BR>
<B>To:</B> <A HREF="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A> <BR>
<B>Sent:</B> Saturday, December 06, 2003 9:48 AM<BR>
<B>Subject:</B> Re: Fuel/Water, Bearing/Rust<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Bob:<BR>
You might want to take a look at the plated clunks occasionally, I've had the plating break down, (possibly from vonstant vibratory contact with the bottom of the fuel tank) and then the brass begins to corrode. Bill Glaze<BR>
<BR>
Bob Pastorello wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Also, most clunks I've seen lately aren't brass-looking. They apparently<BR>
are plated and look shiny-brite metal. I've drilled some of them, to find<BR>
they're brass underneath. So that sort of begs the question, WHY would fuel<BR>
tank manufacturers add the expense of plating a KLUNK ??<BR>
My Mintor setup has no brass that I can see; it will be interesting to<BR>
see how this goes. Has an MK tank, aluminum tubes, nylon tees in lines.<BR>
Plated clunk in the tank.<BR>
<BR>
Bob Pastorello, Oklahoma<BR>
NSRCA 199, AMA 46373<BR>
<A HREF="mailto:rcaerobob@cox.net">rcaerobob@cox.net</A><BR>
<A HREF="http://www.rcaerobats.net/">www.rcaerobats.net</A><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: "Brian Young" <A HREF="mailto:b4598070@yahoo.com"><b4598070@yahoo.com></A><BR>
To: <A HREF="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org"><discussion@nsrca.org></A><BR>
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2003 7:45 AM<BR>
Subject: RE: Fuel/Water, Bearing/Rust<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Cant remember if the fuel needed the water in it to<BR>
break down into acetic acid..anyone recall? ;0<BR>
<BR>
I have had older brass clunks corrode the nipple off<BR>
at the end of the tubing.....I have noticed the little<BR>
green brass particles plugging up the ports on some of<BR>
my engines....always wondered why they used the brass<BR>
for this stuff. I use plastic or aluminum if I can,<BR>
and steel clunk if available.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
--- Dwayne & Nancy <A HREF="mailto:dwaynenancy@cox.net"><dwaynenancy@cox.net></A> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
Bob, Joe said that blaming water in the fuel as the<BR>
cause of bearing<BR>
rust was a "folk tale". The cause was the fuel<BR>
decomposing into acetic<BR>
acid (vinegar). The decomposition is caused by the<BR>
catalytic effect of<BR>
the brass components inside the fuel tank. Joe<BR>
tried leaving bearings<BR>
in several brands of fuel for four months without<BR>
any rust forming. You<BR>
should read the magazine more carefully. You can't<BR>
tell when something<BR>
valuable with show up. <VBG> Dwayne<BR>
<BR>
-----Original Message-----<BR>
From: <A HREF="mailto:discussion-request@nsrca.org">discussion-request@nsrca.org</A><BR>
[<A HREF="mailto:discussion-request@nsrca.org">mailto:discussion-request@nsrca.org</A>]<BR>
On Behalf Of Bob Pastorello<BR>
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2003 8:25 PM<BR>
To: <A HREF="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A><BR>
Subject: Re: Fuel/Water, Bearing/Rust<BR>
<BR>
Okay - Matt - since my MA already found it's way to<BR>
the shredder....<BR>
WHAT did he say about rust protection?<BR>
<BR>
Bob Pastorello, Oklahoma<BR>
NSRCA 199, AMA 46373<BR>
<A HREF="mailto:rcaerobob@cox.net">rcaerobob@cox.net</A><BR>
<A HREF="http://www.rcaerobats.net/">www.rcaerobats.net</A><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: <A HREF="mailto:Rcmaster199@aol.com">Rcmaster199@aol.com</A><BR>
To: <A HREF="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A><BR>
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2003 6:11 PM<BR>
Subject: Fuel/Water, Bearing/Rust<BR>
<BR>
The diatribe of the last week or so on this list has<BR>
been, shall we say,<BR>
rather........ interesting, (except for the news<BR>
about Kirk Gray, that's<BR>
plain sad). It's time for something new.<BR>
<BR>
In this month's Model Aviation, Joe Wagner talks<BR>
about experiments he<BR>
has run with a trusty old engine. He ran baseline<BR>
performance data with<BR>
his regular fuel and then he added water in his fuel<BR>
to see how badly<BR>
performance would be affected. His results where<BR>
very interesting. Shall<BR>
we say that he made chopped meat out of that "sacred<BR>
cow".<BR>
<BR>
He also briefly touches on what really is the root<BR>
cause of bearing<BR>
rust. Even the uninitiated should find that<BR>
interesting. Could a<BR>
solution to all of your OS bearing woes be this<BR>
simple?<BR>
<BR>
There, that ought to whet your whistle.<BR>
<BR>
Matt K<BR>
<BR>
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