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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I think you have to also consider that they
are relative to the thrust line.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>WG<BR> </FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=getterflash@yahoo.com href="mailto:getterflash@yahoo.com">Bob
Kane</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=discussion@nsrca.org
href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, March 30, 2004 7:55
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: Trimming Help</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>I have to ask . . . . . what is the difference between adding
positice incidence to the wing versus negative to the stab? Are they not
relative? <BR><BR><B><I>Dean Pappas <<A
href="mailto:d.pappas@kodeos.com">d.pappas@kodeos.com</A>></I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">Hi
again Paul,<BR>Many planes trim nicely with a small amount of positive
incidence in the wing, compared to the stab.<BR>The typical amount is about
1/4 to 1/3 degree, or a little over 1/16" over the wing chord. If you have
full degree of incidence in the wing, you may have a belly-pitch in knife
edge, unless terribly nose-heavy. Now we need to ask those of you out there
with well trimmed Tai-Ji to tell us where your CG is. There's no sense in
re-inventing the wheel. Put the CG there, and adjust/shim the incidence
'till the elevator trim goes away, and let's see where we are.<BR><BR>Before
doing that, are you sure that the ailerons aren't both trailed up or down,
even a little?<BR><BR>Don't let us forget you, until this problem is
licked,<BR>Dean<BR><BR>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: David Lockhart
[mailto:DaveL322@comcast.net]<BR>Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 11:06
AM<BR>To: discussion@nsrca.org<BR>Subject: Re: Trimming
Help<BR><BR><BR>Paul,<BR><BR>Most of the trim advice being given is based
(rightly so) on some<BR>assumptions -<BR>- the plane is straight and
true,<BR>- ail hinges are sealed,<BR>- servos are tracking evenly throughout
the range of throw (as measured by a<BR>throw meter - Budd Laser, CRC, Ivans
Gadget, etc),<BR>- all references to ail throw and ail differential refer to
actual measured<BR>throw at the aileron (as opposed to an
ATV/endpoint/differential setting in<BR>the radio).<BR><BR>Another thing I
would suggest - if possible, have another experienced<BR>pattern pilot fly
the plane and see if they find the same problem - and it<BR>gives you an
opportunity to very critcically watch the plane and evaluate<BR>without
needing to concentrate on the actual flying.<BR><BR>As Dean P said, negative
ail differential is rarely needed, but not out of<BR>the question. Most of
my planes end up with no differential, or a very<BR>slight amount of
positive differential - but I did have one that required<BR>negative
differential.<BR><BR>Good luck,<BR><BR>Dave
Lockhart<BR>DaveL322@comcast.net<BR><BR><BR><BR>----- Original Message
-----<BR>From: "Paul Lawrence" <PWL45@YAHOO.COM><BR>To:
<DISCUSSION@NSRCA.ORG><BR>Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 8:19 AM<BR>Subject:
RE: Trimming Help<BR><BR><BR>> The plane is a Tai Ji 60. I may have found
an<BR>> incidence<BR>> problem too. I don't really know where the
reference<BR>> line is for this model and I am also still
learning<BR>> how to check incidence, but if I block up the plane<BR>>
and get the wings at 0 degrees and then check the<BR>> stab, it is
showing -1 degree of incidence. That seems<BR>>
excessive.<BR>><BR>> I'm flying Intermediate and the yaw really shows
up on<BR>> the humpty bump and full roll up on stall turn. When I<BR>>
perform the humpty bump, I pull to vertical, 1/2 roll<BR>> right and the
plane heads off to the left(belly in).<BR>> On the full roll up, the
plane heads off to the right<BR>> after rolling right.<BR>><BR>> So
far, I have received a lot of good advice and have<BR>> several things to
try. Thanks.<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>> ><BR>> > -----Original
Message-----<BR>> > From: Paul Lawrence
[mailto:pwl45@yahoo.com]<BR>> > Sent: Sun 3/28/2004 10:33 PM<BR>>
> To: discussion@nsrca.org<BR>> > Cc:<BR>> > Subject:
Trimming Help<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> > After getting soundly
beat in Ocala last weekend, I<BR>> > realized that I have been getting
proverse yaw as my<BR>> > plane rolls.<BR>> > It wasn't evident
until I saw other well-trimmed<BR>> > planes flying.<BR>> > The
plane yaws in the direction of roll input and I<BR>> > have been
experimenting with a multitude of aileron<BR>> > differential settings
and can't seem to remove the<BR>> > yaw.<BR>> > With zero
differential, the plane still yaws in the<BR>> > direction of
roll.<BR>> > The trimming chart says to reduce differential in<BR>>
> this condition, but I have reduced it to zero.<BR>> > Should I
program in negative differential(doesn't<BR>> > sound good) or should
I program a litle bit of<BR>> > opposite rudder correction to offset
the proverse<BR>> > yaw?<BR>> ><BR>> > Also, does CG and
Incidence affect adverse or<BR>> > proverse yaw while rolling?<BR>>
> The plane was a little nose heavy and I have also<BR>> > been
adding tail weight to try and clean up the<BR>> > rolls, but still
can't get that yaw out of the<BR>> > rolls.<BR>> ><BR>>
><BR>> ><BR>><BR>>
=====================================<BR>> # To be removed from this
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instructions.<BR>><BR><BR>=====================================<BR># To
be removed from this list, go to http://www.nsrca.org/discussionA.htm<BR>and
follow the instructions.<BR><BR>====================================# To be
removed from this list, go to http://www.nsrca.org/discussionA.htm<BR>and
follow the instructions.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR><BR>Bob
Kane<BR>getterflash@yahoo.com
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