<HTML><HEAD>
<META charset=US-ASCII http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=US-ASCII">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1106" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff">
<DIV>
<DIV>I was on site 1 Wednesday evening after the Masters flying was over for the day, when the F3A Finalists started their practice sessions on site 3. Originally, F3A Finals was to be flown on site 3 and Masters on site 1, as had been done in previous years. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I was surprised to see the far side of the Rolling Circle from site 3, over the runway on site 1. Folks that's around 500-600 meters or around 1/4-1/3 mile from site 3's pilot station. with a diameter that large, the circle circumference is pretty close to 1 mile and at the typical model speed, a 45-50 second circle was being done during those practice sessions. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>A clearly unsafe situation could have existed if we allowed the Finals to go on as originally planned. I went to site 3 and discussed the observation with Don Ramsey and Dave Guerin and we switched sites for the two Finals</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>The good news is that our TEAM members have a whole year to practice this maneuver and get it looking great in the appropriate amount of sky. Consider this--At a reduced speed of around 60-70 mph, and a diameter of around 100-120 meters, the model must fly a circumference of around 400 meters or around 1/4 mile. The maneuver will still take around 15 seconds to fly</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Another observation I had regarding the circle during the F3A Finals, was that the roll rate was so slow that the wing tended to rachet (momentarily stop rolling) on some models. As though the rudder and elevator inputs were counteracting the ailerons since aileron deflection was so slight. I recommend that a more defined roll rate (faster) be established up front and the maneuver size adjusted to fit the roll rate. Don't give the judges obvious reasons for doubt.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>MattK</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px solid">
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> discussion-request@nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request@nsrca.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>tony@radiosouthrc.com<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, July 29, 2004 7:06 AM<BR><B>To:</B> discussion@nsrca.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Proper Distance<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Earl:<BR><BR>What a concept! Flying within the rules gets the best score.......</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If the contestants were watching the distance out flights before we started the finals, they could see that we were calibrating the group to the distance that the group should start downgrading for being too far out... Flying along a line about 160-170 meters would seem IDEAL.... Still, as you say, most try to fly about 150.... Not sure why...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Tony Stillman<BR>Radio South<BR>3702 N. Pace Blvd.<BR>Pensacola, FL 32505<BR>1-800-962-7802<BR><A title=http://www.radiosouthrc.com/ href="http://www.radiosouthrc.com/">http://www.radiosouthrc.com/</A></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=mailto:ehaury@houston.rr.com href="mailto:ehaury@houston.rr.com">Earl Haury</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=mailto:discussion@nsrca.org href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">Discussion List, NSRCA</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, July 29, 2004 8:56 AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Proper Distance</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Distance in pattern has been (and still is) one of the great unknowns. (Spins & snaps are the others.) There are varied individual definitions of what is proper, regardless of how much clarity or definition is inserted into the rules. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I've been around long enough to see the trend move in and out several times, often the out times are well outside of the rules. Then there are times when others decide that there are more points in really tight! </FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>Unfortunately, distance out is hard for the both the pilot and the judge to discern with accuracy. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>A pilot can practice with spotters to establish a good feel for distance. That "feel" comes both with visible size recognition and time from box line to box line at the "comfort" speed. In too close and one is rushed or must slow below the "sweet spot" speed, too far out and the opposite occurs. So the pilot has the opportunity to tune for his / her chosen distance</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>It seems that, on the judges side, there are distance police. Anything that might be approaching the limit is downgraded by them. Then there are others that don't downgrade if they can see (or hear) something out there! More evidence that distance evaluation is difficult, especially when viewing airplanes of different size, visibility, and speed. Maybe the only was to achieve judging accuracy regarding distance is to use a "distance judge" at 175 & 200m and let them assign distance downgrades? Seems that the variable application (with good intentions) of distance downgrades presently experienced dictate consideration of an alternative method.
<DIV></FONT> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>From the judges chair I find very few close in flights accurate or smooth. There are usually inaccuracies brought on by lack of time, box violations, and errors forced by wind. The good thing about these is that they are over quickly. Out flights often have better maneuvers as the pilot has more time, box violations are few, and wind effect is better handled (and/or less noticeable). But they do take forever and the distance downgrades offset the advantages. So what to do? Take a clue from the rules "for a large, highly visible model aircraft a line of flight approximately 175m in front of the competitor may be appropriate". Judges take note of the "in front of the competitor" statement, as the judges are 7 to 10m behind the competitor. This moves the acceptable flight line 7 to 10m further away, so 185m (from the judges) is not to be downgraded for the large models (anybody seen small models lately). </FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>Even the rolling circle distance issues can then be handled by rolling in then. A 100 to 125m roller in would still leave a 50+m buffer between the pilot and airplane.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>So - consider that the rules are OK. Big airplanes are best flown at the outer range of the rules. Some judges may need help in accurately assessing distance. Maybe a distance judge would help. There are no benefits and more risks to flying too close if to only appease "inaccurate" distance police. Hmmm - imagine that, flying within the rules gets the best score..</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Earl</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>