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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If the rudder induces a pitch to the belly when on
knife edge...It should also induce the same pitch to the belly upright,
inverted, and on 45's of roll. If it is different upright-inverted and knife Its
not a very good design. I have come across this on some models. In the past
couple years I have noticed it...These models would act different in roll couple
with rudder Upright vs. Inverted. I have my own ideas as to why this is the
case...but its an aerodynamics thing and according to the experts it makes no
difference. I have just noticed that all the models with this design feature
seem to do it and the models without this feature don't. This is just a
interesting thing that made go hmmmm in the past year or so.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Back to the question,</FONT><FONT face=Arial
size=2> if you have it mixed and on all the time this coupling is counteracted
and overcome by the mixing all the time. However this mixing does become
speed sensitive as the slower you get the less effect the Elevator "trim" will
be be...Also if you setup the mix at full throttle for knife edge and then don't
use full throttle for the knife edge it will not have enough "elevator trim" to
fly at a lesser speed....Same goes for mixing at half power and then flying it
at full power...you will now have too much mix (elevator trim),</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This is the problem when you start running
mixes.....Also its rare that the amount of mix needed if linear to the amount of
rudder input...Many times the mix to maintain knife is nearly nothing but the
mix to counter the coupling at full rudder deflection will not be even close to
proportional.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Again depends on the model...But mixing is not a
bad thing, and if you model doesn't have pure yaw then you should mix it so that
it does. If mixed out properly then you will not see its effects. Of course it
is possible that some things can be solved with other physical parameters that
can trim the model. It is best to trim with the mechanical changes in the model
rather than electronically...I don't have and have never had a model that
required nothing in terms of a mix...Many models use a little down elevator at
idle for the downlines. Some don't. Also most model need some roll mixing for
rudder too. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Even if your class doesn't fly knife edge, and even
if its a little bit of coupling mix it out to lower the work load on you the
pilot. I guess bragging rights about a model being zero mix are just too
important. I can say that I have mixing in every single model I own. Some have
more than others...but they all have some. It makes it easier to fly the model.
But if not done correctly it will make things worse too.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TN</FONT></DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=flyintexan@houston.rr.com
href="mailto:flyintexan@houston.rr.com">Mark Hunt</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=discussion@nsrca.org
href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, August 22, 2004 5:00
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Zn-Line Alliance trimming
question</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have a question regarding pitch mix with
rudder. If you mix some up with rudder, won't it appear when trying to
wind/yaw correct when flying inverted?...causing the plane to drop the
nose?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I wondered about stall turns also, but I guess
the airspeed (nearly zero) would nullify any elevator deflection while using
full rudder.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>-mark</FONT></DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=troy_newman@msn.com href="mailto:troy_newman@msn.com">Troy
Newman</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=discussion@nsrca.org
href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, August 22, 2004 6:43
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Zn-Line Alliance trimming
question</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have flown several Alliances and all of them
needed some pitch mix...Specifically they pitched belly with rudder. And to
be quite honest most of them pitched more than I would like...BUT When this
was mixed out they were extremely great flying models. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I would setup a curve type mix for the
rudd-elev mix....This way you can mix out the coupling at different rates
depending on the amount of rudder deflection. I usually stick 3 points on
each side...Say 1/3-2/3-full rudder stick...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Then go out and fly it and set the mix value
for each rudder deflection. It works well. Some people think the model is
trimmed when they get their mix to zero. Personally I don't really care what
values the mixes are...the question is do they interfere with other
things. My experience with the Alliance is that when its mixed out
properly it flies extremely well and you don't see it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>From the sounds you are happy with CG, up and
down lines so mix it out properly so that at any rudder deflection its
properly corrected and you will never see it in flying it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Good Luck with it</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TN</FONT></DIV>
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