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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Dave !! I didn't make your preferred caller list
??? I thought jokes, the local news and inappropriate remarks were necessary
ingredients for a good round for you !! Tonight's dinner menu, how much beer we
have left and belly flop contests seemed to focus your concentration
!!!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Oh well, guess you'll have to come to Knoxville to
hone my calling skills : )</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Ed M.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=DaveL322@comcast.net href="mailto:DaveL322@comcast.net">David
Lockhart</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=discussion@nsrca.org
href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, January 06, 2005 11:18
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Callers (was Re: AMA MASTER'S
unknown?)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The majority of my practice flights are without a
caller - and without a caller, I think I can fly my best - but, I think
my average flight level without a "preferred" caller (a very limited group at
any point in time) is slightly less than with a preferred caller. This
is for known patterns. For unknowns patterns, the importance of the
caller increases dramatically (at least an order of magnitude).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>For known patterns -</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>When I have a good flight with a "non-preferred"
caller, I don't hear a single word they say - consciously for sure, and I
don't think subconsciously either - I remember very little of what they
said after the flight. If I actually need to hear the maneuver from
my caller (preferred or not), it is not a good flight, and I've consciously
chosen to listen because I had a "brain fart". When I am having a good
flight with preferred caller, I am 100% concentrating on the plane for every
instant from the time the engine starts to the time the engine stops. I
think nothing of the maneuver schedule, and I divert none of my conscious
thought from the plane - I simply absorb information (maneuvers, centers,
proximity to the ends of the box, distance from flightline, etc) from my
caller and on those flights, at the end of the flight I can quote
anything the caller said, while not having specifically heard any of it during
the flight - and on those flights, everything the caller says (sees) is the
same as I am seeing - the confirmation justs adds to the confidence in the
flight.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>For unknown patterns -</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The best flights will only happen with a
preferred caller - whether I have memorized the schedule or not (memorizing it
is preferred). The difference between the best possible flight, an
average flight, and a bad flight is at least an order of magnitude different
than with a known schedule. No matter how small, the additional
concentration I can put into the flying when I have a preferred caller (and I
don't have to think about what maneuver is next) makes a difference when the
scores are compressed at the top. Take a look at the most successful
unknown pilots - most have a preferred caller (if no dedicated), often
selected long before the event. Observe the practice regiment prior to a
flight. And then observe the precision in the flight - it is only
possible because of the focus the pilot has on the plane, and the focus the
caller has on calling the maneuvers with the exact elements (push, pull, shift
in, shift out, roll directions, etc) at the exact times they best can be
utilized by the pilot, and always before the pilot starts to question
what is next.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My comments are based on 17 years of competitive
pattern flying (5 in F3A), about 3 years of practicing unknowns (written
by myself and others, with and with out preferred callers), and
about 5 years of occasional IMAC flying (including flying a borrowed
airplane with a new caller through the Unlimited sequence).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The ideal caller differs from pilot to pilot -
the ideal caller adapts to the personality of the pilot and knows when to
talk, when to keep quiet, and when to provide additional information beyond
the actual maneuvers. As a caller, at the practice field, I give info to
the pilot, and see when and if it is best absorbed (ie, I see the appropriate
response in the plane). I keep giving more info until I think the pilot
is saturated (I no longer see the plane responding to my comments), and then I
back off 10%. And in my 17 years in pattern, I've found the amount of
info and time in which it works best is very different with different
pilots. For myself, there are only a couple callers I would put in the
"preferred" category at any given time - it is rarely more than 1 (Dad) or 2
(Dad and whoever I've flown with the most lately) - but there are a number of
guys that I know think the same way I do, and they would be in the preferred
category after only a couple flights - some of these guys are good friends I
only see annually at the NATs - ain't it a great group to be a part of
!!!!!!!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>On a related note - I've found that I can
maintain my full concentration for about 4 flights back to back. Or
maybe 8 flights through the course of a long day. As a caller, I expend
much less mental energy, but the amount of mental energy I expend increases
the more familar I am with the pilot. If I am very familiar with a
pilot, I expend almost as much mental energy during a flight as if I were
flying myself. On a nice summer evening, I find that after 2-3
flights for me back to back with 2-3 flights I call, my mental concentration
starts to degrade just the same as if I flew 4 flights back to back by
myself.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Dave</DIV>
<DIV></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=rcaerobob@cox.net href="mailto:rcaerobob@cox.net">Bob
Pastorello</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=discussion@nsrca.org
href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, January 06, 2005 6:57
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: AMA MASTER'S
unknown?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Archie, your comments support my position,
particularly with reference to your statement <FONT
color=#000080>""Most pilots have the callers they generally use and that
person usually knows when the person they are calling for likes to hear the
next maneuver."</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> Maybe it's that way in all
the contests YOU go to, but in the ones I attend, there's so many folks
trying to call and carry for each other that it RARELY works that I have the
same caller for two flights out of 6 at a LOCAL contest.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> How much that influences
things is the very issue to be avoided.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I'm not talking about FAI, their capabilities,
or their team events....(you know, sponsors, callers, helpers, all
that), but the regular guys. No offense intended to anyone, but that's
an apples and oranges comparison.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The pilot with the best caller will make the
manuevers look the best, overall, period, end of story. If you've ever
had someone calling for you when you really NEEDED a maneuever, and they
were a heartbeat or two behind, you blew the manuever!!!!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> In NATS FINALS language,
that means the ONE thing that the caller burped on is the maneuver that
knocks you out.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>NO THANK YOU!!!!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><BR>Bob Pastorello<BR>NSRCA 199 AMA 46373<BR><A
href="mailto:rcaerobob@cox.net">rcaerobob@cox.net</A><BR><A
href="http://www.rcaerobats.net">www.rcaerobats.net</A></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=rcpattern@comcast.net href="mailto:rcpattern@comcast.net">Archie
Stafford</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=discussion@nsrca.org
href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, January 06, 2005 5:47
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: AMA MASTER'S
unknown?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I think you can
fly unknowns and also make them very precise and smooth. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Look at the FAI finals.<SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Other than the roller I think the
sequence flowed very well and the top pilots made it look like they had
been flying it for a long time.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes">
</SPAN>Even if you used past sequences or rearranged the current sequence.
<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I do not think
this makes it a “team” event with the caller. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Most pilots have the callers they
generally use and that person usually knows when the person they are
calling for likes to hear the next maneuver. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Also if you use maneuvers that have
been previously used or maneuvers that are reasonably well known then you
shouldn’t have a judging problem. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>If this is going to be used at the
NATS finals, then the judging is usually reasonably good anyway. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I’m sure there will be varying
opinions on that, but for the most part judging in the finals is overall
very good. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The better pilots
are going to make an unknown sequence look smooth and precise no matter
how many times they have flown it. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I think unknowns definitely help
you determine who the best pilot is. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">
discussion-request@nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request@nsrca.org]
<B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Bob
Pastorello<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B>
Thursday, January 06, 2005 6:40 PM<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> discussion@nsrca.org<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: AMA MASTER'S
unknown?</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I guess since I never take a
position on anything, I should probably do so on this -- so -- here
'tis.</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">1. This is a genuine
yes/no POLL question of the MASTERS pilots only....and needs to be
carefully administered, IF the Board is interested in opening this
one.</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">2. If the POLL has at
least 2/3 majority, then the next question should be designed to find
out how crazy we (Masters) pilots are about having our scores judged by
JUDGES WHO HAVE NEVER SEEN THE SEQUENCE and
</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">3. How crazy we are
about the totally-impossible-to-fairly-administer influence of the
"team". At this level of competitions (you guys are talking about
the NATS FINALS, for G---s sake!!!) I would be hard pressed to say it will
be "fair" to have the outcome determined by who had the best caller
(or the most effective team). Not everyone can do that... and
finally ....</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4. MASTERS is supposed
to be the Top AMA class....as such, philosophically, I think it should be
the best - the VERY best - of precision, smoothness, and
gracefulness....</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">AND implementing an Unknown
turns all that back into "IMPRESSION"
judging....</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I'm not in favor of it;
won't be; won't try to persuade others to be; and believe wholeheartedly
that if a pilot is strongly committed to flying Unknowns that he go play
IMAC. Then fly "Pattern" for precision, practiced, smooth and
skillfully-executed "routines".</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><BR>Bob Pastorello<BR>NSRCA 199 AMA
46373<BR><A href="mailto:rcaerobob@cox.net">rcaerobob@cox.net</A><BR><A
href="http://www.rcaerobats.net">www.rcaerobats.net</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">----- Original Message -----
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV style="font-color: black">
<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"><B><FONT face=Arial
size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <A
title=divesplat@yahoo.com href="mailto:divesplat@yahoo.com">Ed
Deaver</A> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">To:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <A
title=discussion@nsrca.org
href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Sent:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
Thursday, January 06, 2005 3:54 PM<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Subject:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Re:
AMA MASTER'S unknown?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Flying an Unknown truely does make it a 2 person
flight. I would still welcome the opportunity as the challange and
thrill(flying well or goofing up and trying to collect yourself to fly
the next manuever) is really great.
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I don't know if it really identifies the callers
ability, as much as the teams ability. Another thought depends on
how much time is allowed to prepare
also.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">ed<BR><BR><B><I><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-STYLE: italic">rcaerobob@cox.net</SPAN></I></B>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
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<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Before I'd answer whether I wanted one or not,
I'd like to have an understanding of what, specifically, the unknown
in Masters would "reveal". If pattern is about precision piloting that
could be a different thing than an ability to have a good
caller....<BR><BR>Just my ignorant opinion.<BR><BR>Bob P.<BR>>
<BR>> From: "Grow Pattern" <BR><PATTERN4U@COMCAST.NET>> Date:
2005/01/06 Thu AM 11:25:48 EST<BR>> To:
<FLYINTEXAN@HOUSTON.RR.COM>, <BR>> <BR><DISCUSSION@NSRCA.ORG>>
Subject: AMA MASTER'S unknown?<BR>> <BR>> How does this list
feel about a Masters Nat's final that was different to <BR>> the
regular schedule. OR, even an unknown in the final to make it more
than <BR>> just three more of the same flown in the heats.<BR>>
<BR>> Regards,<BR>> <BR>>
Eric.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>