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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>On my first attempt at the .070" CF pushrod system,
I bought the CST kit with the teflon sleeve/tubes. After fooling with them for a
while, I pitched them in the trash can and went to the Dubro nylon antenna
tubes. It is almost impossible...at least for me...to get them attached to a
spar without binding. So here is a vote ABSOLUTELY against the flakey/flimsey
teflon.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>For my next airplane, I'm going to use CF tubes
with the CF pushrod and NO balsa supports/ladder. I understand the weight
is about the same.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Evreryone has their own way....smile.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Ken B.</FONT></DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=js.smith@verizon.net href="mailto:js.smith@verizon.net">Scott
Smith</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=discussion@nsrca.org
href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, February 04, 2005 3:35
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> DEPS (was RE: MK Dual
Elavator)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>DEPS
is hands down the best elevator system in my opinion. Also, I would like
to thank Troy for all his efforts in getting out a very nice, complete
setup. However, I think it can be made better with the Teflon
sleeves. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I'm
doing two Central installs in a couple Patriot roaches and I'm a little
disappointed with both installs. Neither are as friction free as last
year's CST kit. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I
had the luxury of installing these while the fuse was still an open box.
My support sleeves are about 21" long and I'd say you could measure the
bend at the halfway point at less than a 1/4". The push rods
hit the center of the MK arms on the elevator (I haven't cut them to length
yet.) For all practical purposes, they are straight and dead on to the
horn. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Yet
there seems to be a lot of friction that needs to be overcome to move the
assembly. Once moving, it moves easily. As such, I'm
concerned about centering.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I
was happy to see the graphite has worked for others and it may be just
the ticket. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=550245920-04022005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
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<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>
discussion-request@nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request@nsrca.org]<B>On
Behalf Of </B>Troy A. Newman<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, February 04, 2005 3:32
PM<BR><B>To:</B> discussion@nsrca.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: MK Dual
Elavator Bellcrank & Pushrod?<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Brian,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>sorry to hear you had some trouble with the
guides on the DEPS. We worked pretty hard on getting the system to
be easy to install and friction free. You are correct that any bending
or curving in the system will cause it to bind up as stated in the
instructions for the DEPS. The Teflon sleeves have their own
problems and what was happening is guys would wind the thread too tight on
the Teflon sleeve and crush it. This would cause friction points along the
length of the Teflon guide even it was dead straight. So the hard plastic
guide kept this from occurring. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The key to both system is getting the pushrods
at a straight shot to the control horns. NO bends no curves. If you install
it this way it will be friction free. The right fuse exit location is so
very important. I use a 4ft long straight edge to connect the dots from the
servo connection location to the elevator control horn. I do this on both
the side of fuse For the vertical location and angle and then the belly of
the fuse for the fore and aft exit location. I use masking tape and project
the lines to where I need to dremel the slot.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial
size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This exit location will be very different
depending on the location of the elevator servo up front and will also
depend on the width of the fuse at the tail and where the elevator control
horns are. So you need to have both mounted so you can align the rods to
pass right by the connection points. No bending them over to
it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>A rough idea is my Supremes' have the exits
about 10.5" forward of the elevator hinge line. A narrow fuse like a Focus
of Temptation this exit will be slightly back further. The key is getting
the slots in the right spot so it doesn't bend. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>NOW some solutions I have heard of and never
tried. Take the pushrods and slightly sand them with some 320 grit. "roll"
the rod in your fingers....The ideal is not to sand diameter down but
sometimes the pushrods can have some ridges on them from manufacturer. I
think they are Pultruded (sp?) and this can cause some slight imperfections
in the surface but I'm not sure. I have seen a few of
these with the CST rods. Never caused me any problems but I can see if the
guides are curving it could.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Next a little messy perhaps at first...Graphite
dry lube like pine wood derby wheel lube works pretty good. Squirt a little
in the tubes and the then install the pushrods. I heard of a guy doing this
and he said it made all the difference. If you have to remove a glue joint
on your pushrods to get it apart just heat the metal fitting up with a
solder iron or a Bic lighter the glue will soften and you can remove the
fitting. A little sand paper on the end where the glue was and the pushrod
system will come right out of the guides from the front. Then deal with
the guides and glue the ends back on. I recommend clean the old glue
out of the hole. I use a drill...but be careful the titanium ends are very
tough and you can break off a drill bit if you are trying to remove metal. I
then use rubbing alcohol to clean it. Dry with a bic lighter and then glue
it on again. Works fine.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Next is sometimes you can get paint and crud in
the tubes at the exits and this will cause some binding. Clean out the exit
tube with a small round file....I have even used a long 2-56 pushrod
threaded on one end to plunger the tubes and clear some debris. I even
saw one where the guy used some Thin CA to attach something and it ran down
the CF rod and into the sleeves. It didn't glue it in place but it did cause
quite a bit of binding. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have not heard of guys having problems.
Usually all you hear form this list and RCU is the bad stuff and rarely does
the good comes through. I get tons of emails from guys that love it. I
wondering if you try some of the fixes above and they solve your issue. I
just installed this system on friends Angel Shadow and it works great! By
the way Exits on it were about 11" forward of the elevator hinge line and
they are a straight shot servo to the control horns.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>As for weight I just stuck the plastic tube
guides on a scale and the Teflon guides as I have both. The Teflon one
4ft long was 6grams The Plastic one 40" long was 5grams....</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The 0.070" solid CF rods can't run unsupported
for the length of the fuse. They will bow up when put under load. But inside
the guides they are stiffer and more solid than any system I have ever seen
or flown. This includes cables, MK, Dave Brown Fiberglass arrow shaft( the
black one is fiberglass and not CF) And the CF rods done like the Dave
brown fork with a bushing support in the back. and supports in the
middle too. The elevators get no differential between sides when under
load and many of the other system do. This was the whole reason for using
the DEPS system. Eliminate differential side to side and have a friction
free slop free system that was light.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Troy</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=auto7832@bellsouth.net href="mailto:auto7832@bellsouth.net">Brian
Billings</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=discussion@nsrca.org
href="mailto:discussion@nsrca.org">discussion@nsrca.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, February 04, 2005 11:33
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: MK Dual Elavator
Bellcrank & Pushrod?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Speaking of the CF push rod set ups, I would
like to share a little info. I just finished installing my second CF.
elev. pushrod assem. in a Impact, the first was in my Majestic. In the
Majestic I got the DEPS setup from CST seen here <A
href="http://www.cstsales.com/CCPush-rodKits.htm">http://www.cstsales.com/CCPush-rodKits.htm</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This kit comes with a thin walled Teflon
outer case and even with a slight bow or arc in the assem. the system
remains Very friction free.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>For the Impact I purchased the kit from
Central and it comes with plastic outer cases and these were
difficult to get smooth and friction free, the slightest bend or arc made
the movement very stiff and as a matter of fact, I could not even use them
and ended up using hollow CF. rod for the outer case which worked very
well but slight bends or arcs are out of the question. Just my
personal experience, yours may differ.</FONT></DIV>
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