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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I have to chime in that I agree with Eric
on wanting NSRCA submitted proposals. My previous comment was really just to
say “we need more action and less conversation”. I have to
apologize that it was a poor statement. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I’ll add to his comment that we have
to be careful on this list…in that it only represents a small portion
(albeit and active portion) of our whole group. The survey hits a broader
audience, and also allows people to reply with some level of group anonymity…something
that tends to encourage feedback.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Mark<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
discussion-request@nsrca.org [mailto:discussion-request@nsrca.org] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Grow Pattern<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, June 13, 2005 5:53
PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">discussion@nsrca.org</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: Landing Direction;
Spins, and Snaps. . .</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Ach! I just hemorrhaged,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> The
real issue is that we have different opinions creating two camps. It is
normally a simple exercise to resolve these types of debate. We take
a democratic vote. The majority wins and we move on. This is not the
case and not what happened or happens here. The last survey vote was
ignored and an individual proposal made. (It is more PC to say
"individual" than "private"). It looks like that he survey
vote will not even be waited for on landing direction.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><st1:PersonName w:st="on"><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Mark</span></font></st1:PersonName><font
size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:black'> Atwood encourages individual action and this type of
proposal making. It sounds good at first until the contest board gets five
different proposals on the same subject or even fifty. (Of course you
might not know but there is a pre-filter on the front of the AMA contest board
system that I have yet to decode?).<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>It does beg the question of what is the
point of belonging to a society if you don't support the gathering
of survey answers like scoring 0 through 10 for take-offs and landings.
Are you a society member when you agree and an individual AMA member when you
don't?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>I took a bunch of heat for recanting what
happened in the last cycle. Individuals made an individual proposal that not
only was in direct opposition to the majority vote but also is causing a ton of
explanation and translation work that falls back on the society and its
officers. It does not inconvenience the individual proposers.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Pointing out the individuals and
their involvement and official AMA record of their involvement did get me some
more direct and indirect hostile e-mail. There was even financial pressure
put on the NSRCA because of my explanations of what went down. There was
nothing in what I wrote that was a personal attack. They finally keyed in
on my "teaser" about not living in <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Florida</st1:place></st1:State> as being a mortal insult. I guess
the smiley was just not cutting it? <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>My replies to the direct e-mail were/are
simple. <strong><b><font face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'>You wrote,
you signed it, stand by what you did, stop trying to shoot the messenger,
listen to the feedback and observe the confusion when proposals are not
coordinated and "English/rules book" processed by our (the NSRCA)
resources.</span></font></b></strong> You know, I did not see any offers
to help or correct the situation, from the proposing individuals. I did see our
very own Don Ramsey do work to try and clean it all up. I do see judging
schools spending inordinate amounts of time on the subject. I do expect
personal attacks to continue to be made in my direction. It always does when
you hit a nerve.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>Eric.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial id="role_document"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black'>> <br>
><br>
> From: discussion-request@nsrca.org <br>
> [mailto:discussion-request@nsrca.org] On Behalf Of Keith Black<br>
> Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 10:19 AM<br>
> To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">discussion@nsrca.org</st1:PersonName><br>
> Subject: Re: Landing Direction<br>
> <br>
> Marguerite,<br>
> <br>
> Actually, I don't think you're alone on this issue. The NSRCA poll <br>
> showed overwhelmingly that the membership wanted scored t/o and <br>
> landings as did the public outcry after the majority's desires were <br>
> disregarded. Apparently even the contest board would have voted to <br>
> keep the old rule but the question was worded in such a way to confuse <br>
> two of the contest board members.<br>
> <br>
> Now that the new messed up rule has caused so much confusion I think <br>
> everyone is getting so fed-up with it that many would rather have <br>
> nothing at all than what we have now. To me this has more to do with <br>
> being sick of all the ridiculous discussions than a real desire of <br>
> pattern pilots to not score t/o and landings.<br>
> <br>
> I for one have been paying attention to take-offs and landings this <br>
> year and find it a real shame that we don't have those beautiful <br>
> centered liftoffs and gentle climb outs. The new guys coming into <br>
> sportsman will miss out on this discipline.<br>
> <br>
> Keith<br>
> <br>
> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
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