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<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=409112802-15062005>Even with the old TO and
Landing rules one couldn't relax from the time of takeoff until landing.
One had to ensure that the pilot did not do any "hot-dogging" on the downwind
legs after takeoff and prior to landing... so I don't see what the difference is
between then and now.</SPAN></DIV><BR>
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<FONT face=Tahoma><B>From:</B> discussion-request@nsrca.org
[mailto:discussion-request@nsrca.org] <B>On Behalf Of
</B>MargueriteVG@aol.com<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, June 14, 2005 10:51
AM<BR><B>To:</B> discussion@nsrca.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Landing Direction;
Spins, and Snaps. . .<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Hi Eric Score T/o and landings ;-) Get
some rest and judge less in one day.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>IT is a lot to sit out in the Judges chair all day I know that
is true. However we should not forget about the scores for landing
because we think its a waste of time.Landing is important to the pilot and
all the pilots standing on the field.</DIV>
<DIV>Marguerite</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>In a message dated 6/14/2005 12:56:00 AM Eastern Standard Time,
pattern4u@comcast.net writes:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px solid"><FONT
face=Arial>An angle from the judges chair based upon being "in the chair' at
the last <BR>ten Nat's<BR><BR>1. I never liked judging FAI's TO's and
Landings because you have to watch <BR>the plane ALL the way around into the
box, then all the way back to the <BR>ground after the last maneuver. I'm
usually distracted and busy sorting out <BR>scribes in difficulty
etc.<BR><BR>2. AMA classes were great. I could relax my eyes after the
take-off and perk <BR>up just before the pilot came back into and called the
box. Now I have to do <BR>FAI duty in all classes.<BR><BR>Multiply this by 20
plus pilots and 4 days and your eyes will creak <BR>audibly - no
joke<BR><BR>Regards,<BR><BR>Eric.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>----- Original
Message ----- <BR>From: "Jerry Budd" <jerry@buddengineering.com><BR>To:
<discussion@nsrca.org><BR>Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 11:55
PM<BR>Subject: Re: Landing Direction; Spins, and Snaps. . .<BR><BR><BR>>
Uhmm, Jerry -<BR>><BR>> What are using for your reference point in
saying that you "never saw a 15 <BR>> sec. difference that could have been
saved"? Stated another way, a <BR>> difference of 15 sec. from
what? If at least one of the contest(s) you've <BR>> observed didn't
score TO&L's (meaning other than 0 or 10) then what are <BR>> you
comparing the measured times too? Did you have timed data from before
<BR>> when TO&L's were scored from 0 to 10 to difference your
measurements from? <BR>> Without that data to establish a baseline you
can't make a quantitative <BR>> comparison, only a qualitative assessment
(which is a fancy way of saying <BR>> "a person's
opinion").<BR>><BR>> Please don't take my questions as an attack,
they're NOT meant that way. <BR>> But collecting invalid data can be as
bad, if not worse, than having no <BR>> data at all. And I'm not
saying that the data you've collected is <BR>> invalid, just that one can't
tell from what you wrote below. Since your <BR>> stated objective is
to use the data to show the "rationale used to support <BR>> the current
proposal was false and it never was backed up by real data", <BR>> then the
legitimacy of your data becomes relevant.<BR>><BR>> Maybe I'm missing
something here, can you help me understand how you were <BR>> collecting
your data?<BR>><BR>> Jerry (the other one, out on the left
coast)<BR>><BR>><BR>>>Terry, you are being generous. I actually
timed and recorded a bunch of <BR>>>them at the last contest and never
saw a 15 sec. difference that could <BR>>>have been saved. I intend to
do this at every contest this year, and send <BR>>>a data file to all
the Contest Board members during the next rules cycle. <BR>>>I think the
rationale used to support the current proposal was false and <BR>>>it
never was backed up by real data. Actually when you factored in the
<BR>>>currently required maneuvers at TO, and at Landing, the overall
total has <BR>>>to be longer. I guess they were allocating a large
amount of time saved by <BR>>>the Gun and Go approach now being
advocated/accepted.<BR>>>Jerry<BR>><BR>> -- <BR>>
___________<BR>> Jerry Budd<BR>> Budd Engineering<BR>> (661) 722-5669
Voice/Fax<BR>> (661) 435-0358 Cell Phone<BR>>
mailto:jerry@buddengineering.com<BR>>
http://www.buddengineering.com<BR>>
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